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Toy ID Boards => Toy ID Help => Topic started by: ecpblue on Thursday 18 August 2011, 01:28 am

Title: Old dolls
Post by: ecpblue on Thursday 18 August 2011, 01:28 am
Can anyone id these dolls??  

I know the first one is older than the 80s but I figured I would try anyway.  I have no information on the first as she has some sort of tag that has worn off so I can't read anything on it.  She was given to me by my great grandmother- she was hers but I don't know how long she had the doll- the bonnet is the only original thing she is wearing and the tights are b/c she is disentigrating.  She looks kind of creepy in the pic but she does not look this creepy in real life lol, any held would be appreciated!!

                      1. (http://i1094.photobucket.com/albums/i456/ecpblue/DSCN0033.jpg)

the next dolls is from the 80s and I know she is a Gotz doll in original clothing I believe (on her neck it says gotz-puppe There are no other tags or marks, does anyone know who she is??

                       2.  (http://i1094.photobucket.com/albums/i456/ecpblue/DSCN0034.jpg)
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: mouse on Thursday 18 August 2011, 02:02 am
Top one looks like it might be pedigree. Have you checked all under the clothes for a name on the body?
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ecpblue on Thursday 18 August 2011, 02:15 am
I checked and could not find anything no marks at all- her eyes blink and she does have a voice box inside  Here is a better pic of her face- just by taking her off the shelf more of her "skin" fell off....poor doll.....
(http://i1094.photobucket.com/albums/i456/ecpblue/DSCN9724.jpg)

I feel like all the pedigree pics were newer??  I dunno
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: EdenEye on Friday 19 August 2011, 06:41 am
I seem to recognize the 2nd, newer doll. Her face seems familiar. But I can't pinpoint who she is.
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ecpblue on Friday 19 August 2011, 09:52 pm
I was talking to my mom about the 2nd doll and all she remembers is that she bought her in the 80's from a German Gotz warehouse building in Northern Va.  I don't know if this helps anyone!  Thanks for looking!

I just found a similar doll on ebay- this is the 1st time I have ever even seen something close.  Same hair type, same face mold but my doll has a cloth body and does not talk or do anything that requires batteries.  Not sure if this helps anyone. 

(http://i1094.photobucket.com/albums/i456/ecpblue/Ebay%20Pictures/Untitled2.jpg)

(http://i1094.photobucket.com/albums/i456/ecpblue/Ebay%20Pictures/Untitled1.jpg)

Ebay site:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-GOTZ-21-VINYL-DOLL-PLUS-5-OUTFITS-SHOES-/160638081368?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2566c69958
I contacted the seller to see if there is any more info on the box.
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ForeverKokiri on Saturday 27 August 2011, 05:29 pm
Isn't this her?

(http://img.auctiva.com/imgdata/5/0/6/6/7/9/webimg/494367545_o.jpg)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/20-Hard-Plastic-Vintage-Pedigree-Toddler-Doll-/270792543709?pt=AU_Dolls&hash=item3f0c7e4ddd
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ecpblue on Saturday 27 August 2011, 06:16 pm
Thanks for the help- I can't quite tell but it is awfully close!!  Someone else suggested Pedigree but the ones I saw did not look close- perhaps it is a pedigree though? Mine has soft plastic arms and legs.
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ForeverKokiri on Saturday 27 August 2011, 06:43 pm
Ah, now that I look closer I see that the mouths are slightly different and the hands are in a completely different position.

Perhaps yours is a knockoff from the same era? She's really cute, by the way. It's a shame she's falling apart.
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ecpblue on Saturday 27 August 2011, 06:51 pm
thanks!  yeah I really have no idea- I will have to try to take a pic of her without clothes and see if that helps.  I actually called a doll place about trying to get her arms fixed and they told me the best solution was to replace them and since she was my great grandmother's I did not want to. I was hoping that I could just use something to fill in the holes and cracks....she is actually about to lose the 1 arm and I probably should not have moved her, I am almost afraid to move her back...anyway thanks for the help and I continue to try to identify both!!
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ecpblue on Tuesday 27 September 2011, 09:19 pm
Bump!!  :-) The Gotz doll is DEFINITELY 1 of my favorite dolls and I have been wanting info on her for years! 
Still searching for these!
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ecpblue on Thursday 03 November 2011, 04:11 pm
Bump again :-)
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ForeverKokiri on Friday 04 November 2011, 05:32 pm
Alright, since you seem to be serious about finding these dolls, I tried looking for the Gotz one. I found a few things on ebay that may be helpful.

(http://i.ebayimg.com/t/VINTAGE-GOTZ-PUPPE-MODELL-23-INCH-VINYL-ACTION-DOLL-/00/$(KGrHqF,!iUE1Nd+3Nv(BNd!yPEB!w~~_3.JPG)
First up is another talking doll that looks similar to your doll. But, her face mold isn't quite the same. Her hair is similar, however. Which brings me to this doll:

(http://i.ebayimg.com/t/Vintage-Signed-Red-Hair-Gotz-Doll-18-Very-Rare-/00/$(KGrHqUOKjUE5RbbyUGlBOUysov4V!~~48_12.JPG)

I'm going to guess that this vintage doll is about the same age as your doll. Why? Take a look at the facial features. Compared to a lot of the other Gotz dolls on ebay, none of them have quite the same style of facial features. This one has the exact same upturned nose and thick baby lips. The eyes are also spaced about the same length apart.

(http://i.ebayimg.com/t/Vintage-Signed-Red-Hair-Gotz-Doll-18-Very-Rare-/00/$(KGrHqEOKjkE4ofCh(nOBOUytFO8Hw~~48_12.JPG)

Here is a link to the auction if you're curious: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Signed-Red-Hair-Gotz-Doll-18-Very-Rare-/180716458321?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a138a5151
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: zuse on Sunday 13 November 2011, 08:30 am
I think that Gotz doll is like the one my sister has. It's a bit smaller than mine. Are the arms plastic all the way up, or are the top parts fabric like the body?

I think this is a similar one from the same mold. This doll is 42 cm (about 16.5 inches). My doll mold was about 18 or 19 inches (like AG dolls). I think they just had them released with lots of fashions, hair colors, eye colors, etc. I don't know if there were special names for each doll or line.

http://www.ebay.de/itm/190597912893
(http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/files/bmo0-12v.jpg)

And another:
http://www.ebay.de/itm/120803199373
(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTAyNFg3Njg=/$(KGrHqV,!ksE6G3UDO(ZBOrrSFcMuQ~~60_12.JPG)


Maybe you can contact the company? http://www.goetz-puppen.de
I thought they were out of business now (within the past few years) but apparently they still have a website.
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ecpblue on Sunday 13 November 2011, 03:03 pm
ForeverKokiri the first one looks similar but not quite.....

Zuse- her arms are plastic until you get to the area just before the shoulders then they are the same cloth as the body.  The first doll you showed even has the same strange part in the bangs!  I always called my doll Kelly but I am not sure if that was a name she came with or 1 I gave her.  The second doll seems to have the same basic body.  I honestly did not even think to contact Gotz but I will do that now and see what happens, thanks for the idea!  :-)
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: zuse on Sunday 13 November 2011, 08:31 pm
Yeah, yours is like my sister's doll. They are just a bit smaller and a lot "floppier". Mine was from the dolls they made that they made like the American Girl dolls (they were contracted out for them). Mine can stand, sit, etc. My sister's always had to be displayed sitting. :)
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ecpblue on Sunday 13 November 2011, 09:11 pm
ah, yeah mine has to sit :-) I emailed Gotz and attached the picture so we will see what happens!!  I was reading through the history of gotz not too long ago and I found it quite interesting, goes to show you what I knew or rather didn't, I did not even knot that they were related to am girl until I was reading about the history!!!!
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: zuse on Sunday 13 November 2011, 09:46 pm
I still have all my AG Catalogs. I got them for years although I never ordered anything. They must have known my age from other subscriptions I had or something (although I did have the book sets, paper dolls, etc.) Anyways, I did always think my doll looked a lot like them. And I did look at the clothing accessories a lot. I never made a proper wishlist, though, so I never got any of it.

I asked my mom why she picked the stuff she did for presents and she said we never asked for very much or made lists. I feel like I did make lists but never sent them to Santa, haha. I guess it seemed greedy and that Santa should already know. ;) Plus I think I liked surprises.

I think Santa would have skipped doll clothes anyway. That was more grandma and great-aunt territory. ;)
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ecpblue on Monday 14 November 2011, 03:07 am
you know I have Samantha and you can't get much closer than the 2 both with the brown hair and brown eyes and I usually played with them together but just didn't realize that they were related!

I have to laugh about the wish list thing- we never made them either and yet santa and mom always knew what to give us!!  :-) but I do agree santa should have known!!  ;-)  Speaking of surprises, we have a "toy closet" and my sisters and I always knew where are presents were but we never once looked (or at least I didn't) b/c it was more about the surprised, I never wanted to ruin it!! 

Did your grandma and great-aunt make the clothes?
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: zuse on Monday 14 November 2011, 03:15 am
Grandma made clothes. Two years in a row we got a doll for Christmas. Grandma made clothes. :) The dresses for my sister's first doll (like yours) are a bit smaller than the ones for mine (AG sized). The next year I got a Corolle doll from the Delphine line (floppy and overall larger body). I was able to find an old  Corolle catalog online to find that out but there is NOTHING for the Gotz. My sister's second doll was like my first one (AG-like) except she had a blue dress.

Ours had the blonde hair with blue eyes. I'm guessing you're a brunette? :)
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ecpblue on Friday 18 November 2011, 05:03 pm
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: zuse on Friday 18 November 2011, 05:29 pm
Well, I guess it's up to us to keep a lookout for old Gotz catalogs! :)
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ecpblue on Saturday 19 November 2011, 01:36 am
It appears that way!   ;)  I appreciate it though!
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: zuse on Monday 21 November 2011, 05:11 am
We need to track down... the calendars, methinks!

(1989 Gotz German Doll Calendar)

(http://images.cloud.worthpoint.com/wpimages/images/images1/1/0211/08/1_3b8e7a6d089f107796e21d7e1ab58ad2.jpg)

(http://images.cloud.worthpoint.com/wpimages/images/images2/1/0211/08/1_3b8e7a6d089f107796e21d7e1ab58ad2.jpg)

(http://images.cloud.worthpoint.com/wpimages/images/images3/1/0211/08/1_3b8e7a6d089f107796e21d7e1ab58ad2.jpg)
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ForeverKokiri on Tuesday 03 January 2012, 05:19 pm
Your first doll has a doppleganger! I saw a very similar doll in an antique doll shop that was a composition doll from the 30s. I don't think yours is composition, but it can be hard to tell from a photo. Is she plastic or something else?
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: zuse on Monday 09 January 2012, 02:32 pm
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=330668593510

Catalog for sale. :)
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ecpblue on Tuesday 10 January 2012, 12:27 am
Thanks Zuse!  I just sent them a message!
Title: Re: Old dolls
Post by: ForeverKokiri on Thursday 12 April 2012, 03:30 am
All right, I've been doing some digging here for that first doll.

She appears to be a "Shirley Temple" type doll, as evidenced by that open mouth with the teeth.

You said she is disintegrating, so she is likely pre-1960s because she is not plastic. Is she made of rubber, composition (a hard material) or "magic skin" material (stuffed vinyl)?

Also, did she ever have painted-on eyelashes? I ask because most old "sleeper" dolls have eyelashes painted below the eyes. If not, that may be her defining feature.